Well, folks, if the “tax breaks to the rich “are allowed to expire in January, even the “little people” will see gigantic increases in tax payments. Those who are now in the 10% bracket will go up to about 18%; the 25% up to 48%. This is the “hope and change” that you voted for?????
I remember when those “tax breaks” went into effect. My takehome pay for a two-week period changed barely enough to buy a cup of coffee at Caribou. I think I can stand it when they expire.
Why not give the rich more of their own money? What could they possibly do with their own money that is so terribly bad for the country compared to government spending on foreign aid, bailouts of banks, corporations, endless “wars”, etc? Even if they spend the money lavishly on gold-plated faucets in their bathrooms, isn’t someone going to benefit from the work?
That’s not to say that some government spending isn’t good, but really, if the rich keep more of their money, what great evil does that represent?
Conservatives don’t learn because they don’t want to, they prefer the comfort of their myths, and then the rest of us have to suffer when reality meets their myth.
Grab any history book that wasn’t printed in Texas and read about the late 1800’s and you will see why you need a Democracy to combat the greed of the Rich (at least read the news stories about how Wall Street operates that come out after the crash of 2008 - for the rich enough is never enough), then read about the Great Depression and you will see why we need Government on our side.
History teaches us that the old joke about the Golden Rule is so very true: Those Who Have The Gold Make The Rules!
^ The same way you discuss anything with Rightie failures that allow their government to take away the rights of those they do not like and then “claim” to want smaller government.
Righties also aren’t good with numbers 34% + 4% = 38%, not 48%. But you have to re-write the codes to eliminate the deductions before even that will happen.
Just how badly do the GOP have to wreck the Country before the Conservatives even start to see reality, or are they so deeeeeeep into their myths that they will never see.
In the past 8 years America has gone from being the only super-power to a nation that is bogged down in two wars with people who don’t have airplanes, tanks, missles, or anyting more then improvised bombs. – You don’t think places like Iran and North Korea haven’t noticed that.
In 8 year America went from having a budget surplus to being a Nation that is billions in debt to the Nation that is overtaking us in the World Economy.
In 8 years America went from growning economy to one that is mirred in a recession that is quickly becoming a recession.
In 8 years America went from being the Nation the World looked up to for individual rights and freedom, the equality and fairness of laws, and openess of our political process to one where the Government spied on it’s citizens, held people without due process of law, and practiced torture.
And who was incharge during these 8 years???
Conservatives please face the facts and truth or you will continue to take the rest of us down with you.
Can’t you even bring youselves to say that maybe MAYBE the GOP might have messed things in the past 8 year?
just one small point….the GOP have no say in IRS tax rates.
If the Dems do not extend the Bush rates (which were across the board, not “for the rich”)…
a family of 4 with $50,000 income will pay an additional $2,000 on their next IRS tax bill.
That $2,000 spent by all America’s families of 4 would create demand that would need to be supplied by more business and more workers on NEW JOBS.
Every Dollar taken by Government makes private citizens poorer!
The uncertainty that has been created by Obama/Democrats is stifling any business expansion, and is stifling consumer spending. FEAR is the main Obama Product…..
p.s. it is the Obama/Democrats that have EXPLOITED THE CRISIS created by Hoover-type bailouts begun by Bush and tripled by Obama…and all the other Democrat “solutions” since Jan.2009….have pushed the US Economy closer to the brink of collapse!
p.s.2= Unemployment in Bush 2nd term was just over 4% and highest was about 7% and Obama promised his Blowout Bailout would keep it “under 8%” and now it is almost 10% overall and up to 18% in some industries.
harley, as you should know, Fair Tax would increase the burden on middle-class Americans while dropping it on the poor and the rich. (I’ve been doing my reading.)
And it isn’t 23%, it’s 23% of “the cost plus 30% actual sales tax.”
I’m in the top 2% of incomes - I can take spending a few more grand for taxes if I must.
“p.s.2= Unemployment in Bush 2nd term was just over 4% and highest was about 7%”
Yeah, there’s just the small thing about it reaching that 7-and-something just as he was leaving office, after having risen by 3+ % over half a year! Gee, what an irrelevant minor detail, that surely could have no impact on the situation in Obama’s first months.
If the solutions have pushed the US to the brink of collapse, it is worth bearing that before them it was collapsing already.
I have my answer – Read the above posts from the Conservatives and ou will see that
The GOP could destroy American until it is just smoldering hole in the ground and the Conservatives would just keep ignoring it, and go one attacking the DEMS and OBAMA.
Conservatives do not care about their country, they only care about their myths.
The GOP is against Big Government
The GOP will never raise taxes
The GOP will never increase the cost of Government
The GOP will never allow America to be attacked
The GOP will keep the economy strong because they love, and protect small business and the middle class
The GOP always does what is best for America
In America, remember, we believe these “truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”
All men are created “equal”, in that we are, generally speaking, equipped by our Creator to prosper and provide a living for ourselves. That is the antithesis of “according to his need.” One’s needs can be satisfied by one’s sulf-sufficience within a free and lawful environment. That is the American way!
Dtroutma almost 14 years ago
Nothing succeeds like repeating the failures that led to 1929!
mnsmkd almost 14 years ago
Well, folks, if the “tax breaks to the rich “are allowed to expire in January, even the “little people” will see gigantic increases in tax payments. Those who are now in the 10% bracket will go up to about 18%; the 25% up to 48%. This is the “hope and change” that you voted for?????
Norton99 almost 14 years ago
I remember when those “tax breaks” went into effect. My takehome pay for a two-week period changed barely enough to buy a cup of coffee at Caribou. I think I can stand it when they expire.
HabaneroBuck almost 14 years ago
Why not give the rich more of their own money? What could they possibly do with their own money that is so terribly bad for the country compared to government spending on foreign aid, bailouts of banks, corporations, endless “wars”, etc? Even if they spend the money lavishly on gold-plated faucets in their bathrooms, isn’t someone going to benefit from the work?
That’s not to say that some government spending isn’t good, but really, if the rich keep more of their money, what great evil does that represent?
kennethcwarren64 almost 14 years ago
History repeats because we don’t learn.
Conservatives don’t learn because they don’t want to, they prefer the comfort of their myths, and then the rest of us have to suffer when reality meets their myth.
Grab any history book that wasn’t printed in Texas and read about the late 1800’s and you will see why you need a Democracy to combat the greed of the Rich (at least read the news stories about how Wall Street operates that come out after the crash of 2008 - for the rich enough is never enough), then read about the Great Depression and you will see why we need Government on our side.
History teaches us that the old joke about the Golden Rule is so very true: Those Who Have The Gold Make The Rules!
Jaedabee Premium Member almost 14 years ago
^ The same way you discuss anything with Rightie failures that allow their government to take away the rights of those they do not like and then “claim” to want smaller government.
Dtroutma almost 14 years ago
Righties also aren’t good with numbers 34% + 4% = 38%, not 48%. But you have to re-write the codes to eliminate the deductions before even that will happen.
kennethcwarren64 almost 14 years ago
Just how badly do the GOP have to wreck the Country before the Conservatives even start to see reality, or are they so deeeeeeep into their myths that they will never see.
In the past 8 years America has gone from being the only super-power to a nation that is bogged down in two wars with people who don’t have airplanes, tanks, missles, or anyting more then improvised bombs. – You don’t think places like Iran and North Korea haven’t noticed that.
In 8 year America went from having a budget surplus to being a Nation that is billions in debt to the Nation that is overtaking us in the World Economy.
In 8 years America went from growning economy to one that is mirred in a recession that is quickly becoming a recession.
In 8 years America went from being the Nation the World looked up to for individual rights and freedom, the equality and fairness of laws, and openess of our political process to one where the Government spied on it’s citizens, held people without due process of law, and practiced torture.
And who was incharge during these 8 years???
Conservatives please face the facts and truth or you will continue to take the rest of us down with you.
Can’t you even bring youselves to say that maybe MAYBE the GOP might have messed things in the past 8 year?
At lease just a small maybe?
disgustedtaxpayer almost 14 years ago
just one small point….the GOP have no say in IRS tax rates.
If the Dems do not extend the Bush rates (which were across the board, not “for the rich”)… a family of 4 with $50,000 income will pay an additional $2,000 on their next IRS tax bill.
That $2,000 spent by all America’s families of 4 would create demand that would need to be supplied by more business and more workers on NEW JOBS.
Every Dollar taken by Government makes private citizens poorer!
The uncertainty that has been created by Obama/Democrats is stifling any business expansion, and is stifling consumer spending. FEAR is the main Obama Product…..
disgustedtaxpayer almost 14 years ago
p.s. it is the Obama/Democrats that have EXPLOITED THE CRISIS created by Hoover-type bailouts begun by Bush and tripled by Obama…and all the other Democrat “solutions” since Jan.2009….have pushed the US Economy closer to the brink of collapse!
p.s.2= Unemployment in Bush 2nd term was just over 4% and highest was about 7% and Obama promised his Blowout Bailout would keep it “under 8%” and now it is almost 10% overall and up to 18% in some industries.
Thanks, Dems.
Motivemagus almost 14 years ago
harley, as you should know, Fair Tax would increase the burden on middle-class Americans while dropping it on the poor and the rich. (I’ve been doing my reading.) And it isn’t 23%, it’s 23% of “the cost plus 30% actual sales tax.” I’m in the top 2% of incomes - I can take spending a few more grand for taxes if I must.
4uk4ata almost 14 years ago
“p.s.2= Unemployment in Bush 2nd term was just over 4% and highest was about 7%”
Yeah, there’s just the small thing about it reaching that 7-and-something just as he was leaving office, after having risen by 3+ % over half a year! Gee, what an irrelevant minor detail, that surely could have no impact on the situation in Obama’s first months.
If the solutions have pushed the US to the brink of collapse, it is worth bearing that before them it was collapsing already.
kennethcwarren64 almost 14 years ago
I have my answer – Read the above posts from the Conservatives and ou will see that
The GOP could destroy American until it is just smoldering hole in the ground and the Conservatives would just keep ignoring it, and go one attacking the DEMS and OBAMA.
Conservatives do not care about their country, they only care about their myths.
The GOP is against Big Government The GOP will never raise taxes The GOP will never increase the cost of Government The GOP will never allow America to be attacked The GOP will keep the economy strong because they love, and protect small business and the middle class The GOP always does what is best for America
Dapperdan61 Premium Member almost 14 years ago
This is going to be a very looooooooong depression SIGH !!!
fritzoid Premium Member almost 14 years ago
Fair Tax? How about “From each according to his ability, to each according to his need?” What could be fairer than that?
HabaneroBuck almost 14 years ago
Communism is not fair, fritzoid.
In America, remember, we believe these “truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”
All men are created “equal”, in that we are, generally speaking, equipped by our Creator to prosper and provide a living for ourselves. That is the antithesis of “according to his need.” One’s needs can be satisfied by one’s sulf-sufficience within a free and lawful environment. That is the American way!
lungdoc almost 14 years ago
Heavens I love paying for everyone’s health care, retirement, house, car, vote. Yes by all means tax the “evil” rich who actually work and pay taxes.